Burgundy why bother ?

Location
UK
I hate to think of wine as an asset, but depending on, or in certain circumstances, there's no escape from that. But Claude (I think it was?) hit the nail on the head where people have no 'need' for the cash from selling. I think it's crying wolf, indeed BS, where people say they can't drink something because it is now worth x, yet all their needs (from a Maslov perspective) are met, and they have many multiples of x as accessible assets. This neatly outlines my own issue with the OP. Circumstances vary, but unless Keith has a new bed under the arches, empathy is not welling from my very core....

Can't agree 100% here.You can always buy other things with that money: great meals, holidays, gifts/inheritance, charity.

I will open and drink RC, it is the pinnacle of my greatest interest, I will remain unfulfilled without it (nobody mention 'corked'!) but I still need a few years more to make the bottles worthwhile.

If something really means this much to you then who can argue here?
 
I have come to the somewhat reluctant conclusion that such bottles are far, far better enjoyed one at a time rather than in the company of other similar wines.

I take your point & largely agree.

But I'm also curious and I know there's no chance I'll buy any Engel wines beyond what I already have and the opportunity to try a selection of others would be pretty irresistible.
 
Location
UK
Bill, so hypothetically speaking, if a 3 hat MS restaurant was offering meals for free and there were places available, you'd turn them down? You have absolutely everything you could ever want and more money wouldn't change your life a bit?

Again, I concede that some things can hold such a special place in one's heart that you would be extremely reluctant to sell (eg. DRC.)
 
we act rationally for economic purposes

Think it's a research interest for me in 2017 is economics, as most economic behaviour I see (and do myself) seems to be 50% rational at most! Like you'll cross town to get 50% off a £100 coat but not 25% off a £250 one. Wine's probably one of the real outliers in consumer behaviour as it's a luxury good, an investment possibility, totally unfit for purpose for the first 10 years of its life (in the case of some of the greats), and becomes valueless eventually.

And it's a uniquely emotional/irrational "product" it seems to me. I doubt very much that most forumites drink on anything like economic rationality, as obvious from the responses above! Why would you?! The noises I hear (and probably subscribe to, to an extent) is that the effort to create the product is very much part of the enjoyment / utility from the wine drunk, together with the intellectual satisfaction, both of having sourced tt and opened it at the right time, but also of the tasting process. And then there's the (less attractive) satisfactions from being someone of "taste" and part of a relatively exclusive club. Try getting all that on a graph!

The (economic) value of the wine IS the replacement price / opportunity cost but it's probably painful to hear that! Would you hold fast to a stocks/shares investment which has done 10000% in 10 years? What's the difference (there are plenty, of course)?!
 
Bill, so hypothetically speaking, if a 3 hat MS restaurant was offering meals for free and there were places available, you'd turn them down? You have absolutely everything you could ever want and more money wouldn't change your life a bit?

Again, I concede that some things can hold such a special place in one's heart that you would be extremely reluctant to sell (eg. DRC.)
That's the reverse of what I'm saying. I'd rather have the stuff than the money, assuming i anyway have enough money....
 
I have to confess that I have recently sold some of my best bottles, albeit not gladly. A couple of dozen bottles have given me the opportunity to do something that I wouldn't have been able to do otherwise. It is a case of opportunity cost, both ways though as I have now missed the opportunity to sample these potentially great bottles in the future but have gained a different one.
 
Think it's a research interest for me in 2017 is economics, as most economic behaviour I see (and do myself) seems to be 50% rational at most! Like you'll cross town to get 50% off a £100 coat but not 25% off a £250 one.

And this is where economics in itself is not a rational science. Many would see spending £187.50 on a coat as being irrational where spending £50 is quite sensible.
 
I have to confess that I have recently sold some of my best bottles, albeit not gladly. A couple of dozen bottles have given me the opportunity to do something that I wouldn't have been able to do otherwise. It is a case of opportunity cost, both ways though as I have now missed the opportunity to sample these potentially great bottles in the future but have gained a different one.

Maybe the opportunity cost, as Ed suggests, is the key thing that informs everyone's position. If I sold my remaining Engel & Verset wines I'd make a profit and have some more money, but there's really nothing I need or want to do or have with that money so there's really no impetus to sell. Plus the opportunity to drink those wines is one I'll enjoy.

I was wondering about how much (in £££ or %%%) was enough for those who are inclined to sell? Is it really as simple as "Now this wine is worth £xxx it is too expensive for me to drink" or is it more a case of "Now this wine is worth £xxx I can sell it and buy this other thing I want more than the wine and which I couldn't otherwise afford"?
 
And this is where economics in itself is not a rational science. Many would see spending £187.50 on a coat as being irrational where spending £50 is quite sensible.

You're definitely right Steven - my example is poor: there was a better one I came across in a study but couldn't remember it. Is a simpler example that a fiver off a book feels very different to a fiver off a telly, despite it being the same fiver? Perhaps half a book is more attractive than a hundredth of a telly.

The point was that the cash you'd forfeit in each case assumes a "different value" despite it being, er, the same value. The striking examples for me of when this happens are Christmas(!), moving house and (sadly) funerals where (the opportunity cost of) money can become detached from any carefully cultivated notions of value. I remember starting thinking in £k when I was moving house, whereas normally it'd be pence;)!
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Andy and others are of course spot on in that if there's nothing you'd rather have than the Burgundy, no point selling. As I said previously, I’d rather have the peace and quiet of not having to earn the money in the first place, but I think I'm rare(!) and I don’t think capitalism / economic growth works very well like that, so I'm glad we're all different...

It's obviously exercising me this, as I've just thought of another point - there can't be many (if any) consumer goods which give so much pleasure by just being there, doing nothing, for years on end, as wine. Are there any? Aptly, this is one of my biggest problems with red Burgundy, in that the actual experience very, very rarely matches up to the anticipation. I suppose I get a decade of so of sweet tenterhooks for my money, but know that most of the time a claret will be a safer bet.
 
Works of art, Rob?
Waiting ten years for burgundy is quite likely to end in disappointment. At 25 disappointment is rather unlikely unless the vintage is very strong- I can't even remember the last 91 or 92 that wasn't a joy but the great 93 is currently tending to sullenness, all of which reinforces the point that it may be more practical to buy less good vintages.
 
Jon yes the world has actually gone mad as far as I can make out :eek:

I have a few 6s left of Tremblay bourgogne which I think I will have to sell. It makes me a bit cross - it's a very pretty wine, but for the price 6 of the 2012 you could buy 12 bottles of Foillard CdP and 12 of the Corcelette. I know that's not quite like for like but I know which will make me happier. The silly money being bandied around now just puts me off completely, saps the joy from it all for me.
 
Jon yes the world has actually gone mad as far as I can make out :eek:

I have a few 6s left of Tremblay bourgogne which I think I will have to sell. It makes me a bit cross - it's a very pretty wine, but for the price 6 of the 2012 you could buy 12 bottles of Foillard CdP and 12 of the Corcelette. I know that's not quite like for like but I know which will make me happier. The silly money being bandied around now just puts me off completely, saps the joy from it all for me.
That's pretty much the effect it has on me, Ben.

Of course some growers produce BR that is competitive with higher appellation wines, but its hard to avoid the creeping sensation that these prices are more likely to appeal to willing fashion victims than anyone else. Sixty to one hundred pounds (or more) per bottle gets you rather a lot of fun elsewhere.
 
An interesting benchmark (assuming one's spending is disposable income) was a recent discussion with a tailor friend. 18 bts of basically any 2015 GC vs one of her suits which should last as long and (one would hope) give pleasure on more than 18 occasions.
 
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