NWR EV thread (was "Anyone buying a Tesla Model 3 (or any BEV) ?")

I wonder how the fuel saving is calculated? Is it a comparison with the cost of fuel for a petrol or diesel engined car? And is it based on your annual mileage?
Then it seems to get a bit confusing with all the other extras you can get.
I have a BMW 330e PHEV at the moment but its due for renewal in November. I'm not sure if my home charging point will be compatible with a Tesla. I'm more tempted to go for the new model 3 series hybrid rather than full electric.

I was just about to ask the same question about the fuel saving computation.
 
One other thought regarding the cost of electric vs petrol - petrol prices will probably rise, and electricity will rise too. I think the new requirement to have smart metered charging is so that the government can tax EV electricity seperately to domestic electricity.
VED, fuel duty and VAT on fuel raises nearly £40 billion annually, or 7% of all tax revenue, for the exchequer. It would be naive to think the government is going to give that up!
 
I have a BMW 330e PHEV at the moment but its due for renewal in November. I'm not sure if my home charging point will be compatible with a Tesla. I'm more tempted to go for the new model 3 series hybrid rather than full electric.

The Tesla S is Type 2 the Tesla 3 is CCS.

My brother has a BMW 530e PHEV which has a Type 2 socket if the 330e is the same they will not be compatible (with the Tesla 3) so far as plug type is concerned but it may be possible to buy and have installed a new cable from the charging point provider (assuming it is a point with attached cable).
 
AFAIAA, CCS sockets can take Type 2 pliugs - it's got AC type 2 - but the first C means "Combined" so it can take just a type 2.
The exception is that to get rapid charge rates (eg at a Supercharger) you need DC. The DC on CCS is on the fat pins below the Type 2 part of the connector.

Having said that, Tesla type 2 has a funny notch in the socket that makes it slightly non-compatible. I think that's to attempt to avoid people plugging non-Teslas into Superchargers.
 
The Tesla S is Type 2 the Tesla 3 is CCS.

My brother has a BMW 530e PHEV which has a Type 2 socket if the 330e is the same they will not be compatible (with the Tesla 3) so far as plug type is concerned but it may be possible to buy and have installed a new cable from the charging point provider (assuming it is a point with attached cable).

Whatever works for a Tesla s works for a 3, the opposite is not necessarily true.
 
Been enjoying this thread. I’d love a Tesla, and I’m sure I could persuade K at some point as she’s quite eco. But we have no driveway, and the £300 I pay for my parking permit doesn’t give me a dedicated space outside. Until infrastructure is invented for we terrace dwellers, I’m stuffed. Communal unlikely to work either as I reckon half the road (all the Volvo, Audi and Range Rover drivers) would convert along with me.

But what do people think of the new Audi? A hybrid would suit me for driving through Europe and up to my ageing parents in the Midlands (increasingly frequent). Just having the backup of a second fuel does appeal as a way of combining by belief in the end of the world approaching with my need to drive distances.
 
Which Audi? The étron (which has an amusing translation in French!) is just battery powered.
Rapid charging is getting there for long journeys. I think Model 3 and then future X/S will charge at up to 250kW - so you should be able to fill up in about 20 mins.
I think street charging is a big issue. Some councils are investing in lamp post charging. When you have big batteries (100kWh or so) trying to charge on a 7kW charger, then sharing of chargers will be a matter of etiquette yet to be developed!
 
When I visited Denver just over a month ago my friend Patrick had a Model 3, and though I was sceptical of the brand I was won over by it. It is compact, simple and functional, has phenomenal acceleration and corners flat. We hit a pothole and got a puncture and the Tesler recovery service fixed it in 30 minutes.
 
Is anything else close? The Bolt? eGolf?

There’s nothing ‘wrong’ with my car other than it’s an environmental disaster.

If I knew I would own it in five years I’d buy electric now. But inherent expat uncertainty and left hand drive put me off.
 
Certainly not the eGolf. Bolt is not available over here.
Closest would probably be the lower/middle end (Kia eNero and Hyundai Kona - both of which are supply constrained) or the upper end (Jaguar iPace, Audi éTron). I think the Model 3 is technically better than these, although the Jaguar is arguably prettier and the Audi more refined (but these are both more expensive). The big difference is lack of rapid charging for non-Teslas. That in itself is arguably worth £10k (but it depends on your usage). Hopefully there will be a decent independent ultra rapid charge network built up over the next 2-3 years, but that's hard. The odd "fast" charger here and there in petrol stations doesn't really cut it.
These cars should be available for long term hire/leasing to get past the upfront cost.
 
Of course one other thing is this "Full Self Driving" malarkey. I must say it didn't enter my thinking when buying my Model S, and I didn't take up the opportunity for the FSD option when it was temporarily reduced to £2000 a few months back. I do use enhanced Autopilot on mine now and then, although I've got to say that it's less good in the current software version than it was at the end of 2018 (it's now jerky and steers a line too close to the left-hand edge of the motorway lane). When I can do "Navigate on AutoPilot" for long journeys, that'll be good, but I can't see FSD being viable in the UK until it's nearly time for me to get a new car.

What do others think about FSD? Until it can drive me back from WIMPs, I'm not a buyer!
 
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I think the concept of fixed batteries that need to be charged while you wait is inherently flawed. An alternative system would be to commoditise and standardise modular battery packs that could be swiftly removed and replaced with a freshly charged pack. Perhaps the batteries are still too heavy/large for this to be viable, but it would go a long way to solving the range question.
 
I think that with 20 min topups possible via ultra-rapids, this will not be necessary - unless you design it like an F1 pitstop (which would be very expensive!). I presume that such a changeover would likely cost 5-10 mins minimum itself, and require some manual presence. It's so rare that this is an issue, but people do fixate on it.
 
I think the concept of fixed batteries that need to be charged while you wait is inherently flawed. An alternative system would be to commoditise and standardise modular battery packs that could be swiftly removed and replaced with a freshly charged pack. Perhaps the batteries are still too heavy/large for this to be viable, but it would go a long way to solving the range question.

Not sure about that. It's one of those things that's more annoying conceptually than in practice. I regularly drive 500 miles down the south of France with the Tesla and I've come to like my charging stops. Mind you, with the 3 I only do one (overnight) stop in either Nuits Saint Georges or Beaune overnight (I like a break anyways, and allows me to go to Bist'roch or le Soufflot!) and let the car charge either at the Tesla supercharger at the Mercure Hotel in Beaune or at the Tesla destination charger at the Gentilhommiere in Nuits Saint Georges. If overnighting wasn't convenient, I could just let it charge in Beaune for 40 mins and get a quick lunch in town. Very civilised either way and beats motorway petrol station food.
 
Petrol users spend say five minutes at a pump, often less if they pay at that pump. Imagine the potential queues if we all drive electric.

Motorway service areas should have chargers in the ordinary car park. The one I stop at on the M1 does, but with spaces for just two cars. They are near where I habitually park and I always notice the spaces are taken.

It really is all about the infrastructure for so many people. I think private firms don’t want to invest massively and Government is hoping they can pass the responsibility elsewhere, when what is required is a massive joint effort.

As Greta T implied on her visit, we talk a good talk but don’t walk the walk. The Gov just needs to come up with a real plan, not just policy goals.
 
Petrol users spend say five minutes at a pump, often less if they pay at that pump. Imagine the potential queues if we all drive electric.

Motorway service areas should have chargers in the ordinary car park. The one I stop at on the M1 does, but with spaces for just two cars. They are near where I habitually park and I always notice the spaces are taken.

It really is all about the infrastructure for so many people. I think private firms don’t want to invest massively and Government is hoping they can pass the responsibility elsewhere, when what is required is a massive joint effort.

As Greta T implied on her visit, we talk a good talk but don’t walk the walk. The Gov just needs to come up with a real plan, not just policy goals.

The Tesla supercharging infrastructure has always evolved in line with the fleet so it’s never been an issue for me. To give you an example, I was stoping at the Macon supercharger last week on my way back to belgium and saw that they had just doubled capacity there to 20 chargers. Those are almost never on highway service stations so you wouldn’t see them unless you looked out for them. I suspect that capacity would be an issue on the big holiday departure week-end in July/August but that also applies to traffic, hotels and much more.

I’ve now driven about 100,000 Kms with a Tesla and have never had to wait for a charger to be free... that may well change, obviously, but so far so good.
 
The Tesla supercharging infrastructure has always evolved in line with the fleet so it’s never been an issue for me. To give you an example, I was stoping at the Macon supercharger last week on my way back to belgium and saw that they had just doubled capacity there to 20 chargers. Those are almost never on highway service stations so you wouldn’t see them unless you looked out for them. I suspect that capacity would be an issue on the big holiday departure week-end in July/August but that also applies to traffic, hotels and much more.

I’ve now driven about 100,000 Kms with a Tesla and have never had to wait for a charger to be free... that may well change, obviously, but so far so good.
Thomas, excuse my ignorance but do Tesla drivers use separate chargers to everyone else?

I suppose the Tesla satnav tells you where the chargers are and how many there are.

If this is the case, that really makes a difference.
 
That's very encouraging, Thomas - I just found out that there is now (very recently) a Tesla charger within a mile of our home in Calvados so things will only get better, I'm sure!

We have a small quite old petrol car for short day to day local trips and a larger quite new Euro16 diesel for the long motorway trips. I'm sure one of these will be replaced by an EV, but which one? My guess is that the shopping car will be the first to go as it would avoid off-motorway pollution and we are lucky enough to have off-street parking. Public transport really isn't available except for the train to London which we always use when necessary.
 
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