NWR Kitchen Thread

[Thom Blach]

A very widespread preference, Eric, but I always think that having worked so hard for that crisp exterior it seems perverse to sabotage it with moisture. I am however unpatriotic on the subject of the English roast lunch/dinner, which may very well not be a good thing at all.

 

[Simon Smith]

Any views on Fisher Paykel appliances? They have a cashback offer on at the moment.

 

[Simon Grant]

Any views on Fisher Paykel appliances? They have a cashback offer on at the moment.

I've got a couple of their large fridges and am happy with them. Wider than a normal uk fridge, and if you have the space two go together very nicely with respective doors hinged on the outsides.

 

[Jonathan Budd]

220C is not hot for a chicken, is it? I find a 1.3-1.5 kg chicken(always spatchcocked now, the top two wing joints detached and placed on top of the breast, the backbone cut out and put underneath, because I can guarantee a 10C lower temperature in the breast than the legs) takes about 45 minutes from a cool start; in a very heavy cast iron pan, which certainly speeds things up.

Love this method. 30 mins in a steam oven though. Perfect.

 

[Jonathan Budd]

Any views on Fisher Paykel appliances? They have a cashback offer on at the moment.

Having done eleventy million hours of appliance research, much of it focussed on F&P (especially the dishwashers) I came to the conclusion that they are a pretty decent outfit and VFM is very fair. I almost copied Simon's fridge combo until I realised that the space required in the place we wanted to put them precluded other things that we really wanted going along the same wall. Ended up selling a kidney and buying a Liebherr.

I read some very good things about the F&P induction hobs....but they didn't do them with knobs and for some reason the touch sensors on all electric hobs seem to deny that my fingers even exist. They often run the cashback offer, but it still always seemed cheaper to buy elsewhere when I was looking.

 

[Thom Blach]

Love this method. 30 mins in a steam oven though. Perfect.

Do you have the steam on for the whole process?

 

[Johnny Richardson]

I've got a couple of their large fridges and am happy with them. Wider than a normal uk fridge, and if you have the space two go together very nicely with respective doors hinged on the outsides.

You've made my day! I've just ordered one of these (79cm W) for our kitchen rebuild.
Wish I had room for two together which would be fab but I have to be happy with a Beko beer fridge in the garage, next to the Climadiff..

 

[Russell Faulkner]

We will shortly have our own kitchen for the first time in more than 10 years, so lots of interesting stuff here, we will have the inbuilt Miele deep fat fryer referenced above but will need a fridge-freezer, not sure it needs a tv on the front as some do, but the differences don't seem huge for what can be a difference of £2,000 or more...

 

[Mark Palmer]

Ten years with F&P dish drawers (x2) and a fridge freezer.

Dish drawers are brilliant although don’t work for larger than average dinner plates, so if you have these check your sizing prior to purchase. Currently have a Miele full size dish washer which doesn’t clean as well as the dd’s and isn’t as practical to use. Two truly practical advantages to these - you can be running a washing cycle whilst loading another, or you can run a heavy cycle for pots whilst running the other on a light cycle for dishes, glasses etc.

The fridge freezer is surprisingly capacious. Although it’s wide a medium sized version has the capacity of my current Miele double door version. I miss the water dispenser and the ice maker. Beware the ludicrous pricing for the charcoal filter on the water dispenser. The fridge tells you it wants you to replace this every twelve months. Do it every five years or so. The doors may drop due to the extreme width and will need adjustment fairly often. Otherwise a joy to own and use.

 

[Thom Blach]

I've been very happy indeed with a bargain basement Hisense fridge freezer for the last seven years or so. The interior furnishings are not of the very highest quality but it does the job with superb efficiency and economy. Nearly, but not quite, as good as alternatives at five times the price, a tradeoff that should be very familiar to wine enthusiasts.

 

[Chris Davies]

Saw an advert in a magazine for a sub zero or Wolf fridge, can’t remember which one. I can remember the price though! £21600. For a fridge. FFS!

 

[Jonathan Budd]

Do you have the steam on for the whole process?

Yes Tom. Am still experimenting though. Going to try 100% humidity next.

 

[Tom Grande]

I read some very good things about the F&P induction hobs....but they didn't do them with knobs

This is also my concern. Jonathan did you find any make with knobs rather than touch sensitive (or insensitive) buttons?

Also can anyone tell me why induction hobs vary so wildly in price? And do you get what you pay for?

 

[David Crossley]

You can get a cheapish induction hob from Amazon to try out for about £45, which as our build is a five week-er with extra work I think we shall invest in (I think this and our rice cooker with steamer in the dining room will do for two or three nights a week). We have gone for a hob without knobs, partly because one draw was cleaning. Our gas hob is a nuisance to clean and the clean lines of a knobless induction hob appealed.

Why do people want knobs? Is it because their fingers don't work the buttons. That is my worry but I consoled myself that surely this cannot be possible.

Still trying to work out which pans we shall need to ditch. It seems the Le Creusets will be okay (phew!) and our new flat bottomed wok, but having been told stainless steel works, our non-magnetic stainless steel pans which came from Habitat in the 1980s don't look promising (some of the best lasting pans we've ever bought), nor does a very nice copper bottomed pan which I liberated from my parents when we bought our first place in London, and whose lifetime guarantee has not been tested in over forty years.

 

[bob parsons]

David..I enjoyed your write up on Canadian wines. Very well done.

 

[Andrew Blunsden]

You can get a cheapish induction hob from Amazon to try out for about £45,

I am looking at getting one from IKEA (a bit cheaper than the Amazon one) when we have our kitchen done. Probably a bit safer than the old camping stove!

 

[Thom Blach]

You can get a cheapish induction hob from Amazon to try out for about £45, which as our build is a five week-er with extra work I think we shall invest in (I think this and our rice cooker with steamer in the dining room will do for two or three nights a week). We have gone for a hob without knobs, partly because one draw was cleaning. Our gas hob is a nuisance to clean and the clean lines of a knobless induction hob appealed.

Why do people want knobs? Is it because their fingers don't work the buttons. That is my worry but I consoled myself that surely this cannot be possible.

Still trying to work out which pans we shall need to ditch. It seems the Le Creusets will be okay (phew!) and our new flat bottomed wok, but having been told stainless steel works, our non-magnetic stainless steel pans which came from Habitat in the 1980s don't look promising (some of the best lasting pans we've ever bought), nor does a very nice copper bottomed pan which I liberated from my parents when we bought our first place in London, and whose lifetime guarantee has not been tested in over forty years.

Just get an old fashioned children's magnet, David. If it sticks to the pan the pan will work.

 

[Chris Davies]

Although even if magnetic it wont work well if the pan base isn't very flat.

 

[Travis Webb]

This is also my concern. Jonathan did you find any make with knobs rather than touch sensitive (or insensitive) buttons?

Also can anyone tell me why induction hobs vary so wildly in price? And do you get what you pay for?

You can get a Neff induction hob with a "TwistPadFire®". It's a removable disc, used to control the hob.

 

[Jonathan Budd]

This is also my concern. Jonathan did you find any make with knobs rather than touch sensitive (or insensitive) buttons?

Gaggenau or Bora is the answer here Tom. The Gaggenau 400 range or the Bora Pro range. Both are excellent, both cost a small fortune - especially if you want downdraft extraction.

Neff do the twist pads but having tried one out it's not a patch on having a dedicated, front-mounted knob for each burner, which you get with Bora and Gaggenau.

 

[Tom Grande]

Why did I suspect that you were going to say they were expensive Jonathan?! But thanks for the tip, I will look them up

 

[Jonathan Budd]

Maybe you’ll have more luck than me but I couldn’t find decent knobs on the regular brands. So if you want them you have to dig deep unfortunately.

 

[Gary Marshall]

Heading to see the kitchen designer on Monday, last chance to think of the little touches, we’ve specced a charging drawer for phones etc, island with power, qooker tap ( i was against but have succumbed) any other must haves/great ideas?!

 

[Leon Marks]

Heading to see the kitchen designer on Monday, last chance to think of the little touches, we’ve specced a charging drawer for phones etc, island with power, qooker tap ( i was against but have succumbed) any other must haves/great ideas?!

I was also very cynical about the quooker - and I was totally wrong. Same story with the built in microwave. Think about extraction - especially if the hob is on the island. We didn’t get one that rises out of the island itself - in retrospect I’m not sure if this was correct. That said - moving to induction has also reduced the need for extraction - the amount of unintended smoke has reduced drastically...

USB sockets incorporated in all the power sockets has been much more useful than we thought it would.

As I ranted earlier in this thread, having always lived in a single oven situation, going up to four has been awesome.

Obviously the flow through the kitchen is important - we spend a lot of time thinking about cooking / cleaning up / putting the pots and pans away.

Funnily enough both of the kitchen designers we saw tried to talk us down from having such a big kitchen. I’m glad we ignored them.

 

[Jonathan Budd]

Gary...I adore my Quooker tap. I was completely against the idea too as they are stupid sums of money and all the tanks and filters take up a chunk of space...but was persuaded by folk on here...they were right. Instant boiling water is so useful, especially if located close to where you cook. Ours is the prep sink tap. Getting the 'flex' version, which can be pulled out, has worked very well.

Two dishwashers is the best thing I have ever owned in my life. All the advantages of F&P dish drawers and none of the disadvantages. My wife agrees....and that is worth the weight of the dishwashers in gold. Ours are Miele and are pretty far up the range, get amazing reviews from places like Which, and suffer none of the problems that Mark Palmer seems to have had with his.

I'm in love with my Gaggenau ovens (one plumbed-in combi-steam and two 76cm ones for cooking pigs) and the Bora Pro induction hob, which extracts with amazing vigour when searing steaks or frying oily fish - and has proper knobs. Glad to have moved on from the idea that gas is the ne plus ultra; induction is so much better overall.

The thing we did that delivered the most value was thinking very carefully about layout and flow. We have a fairly linear flow that starts with the larder and fridge/freezer, goes via an adjacent large prep area (with a prep sink nearby), then onto the ovens and hob and ends with the dishwashers, another sink and space for clearing/cleaning. Perhaps sounds obvious but I don't think we would have done it that way had I not read an article by a professional chef and discussed things with Mark P who'd done a great job designing his old kitchen. And it tends not to be how many kitchen designers think.

So far (as the kitchen isn't quite finished as the stone company went into lock down just as they were due to template - and haven't re-emerged) the only thing I'd do differently is to think more carefully about the exact size, shape and purpose of every cupboard and drawer. We did this for many of them, and wanted to do it for everything, but lost the will to live as it's a painful process. Hence we ended up just having a load of generic drawers and then figuring out how best to use them. It is then a bit annoying when a desired combination of items is 2mm too big in a given direction.

Good luck. Lots of good tips on the other kitchen thread too.