Wine fridge questions

K

kevin heatherington

Location
Leicestershire
I’ve managed to avoid storing wine in a wine fridge until now using the non-integral garage instead which has a pitched roof and remains below outside temperature in the heat of summer (I turn on a small greenhouse heater inside on the very coldest days of winter where the forecast is for below -4). I’ve done this for 15 years without any problems.

However, a combination of too many piles of boxes making it difficult to access the wine and that our neighbours have cut down a large sycamore that provided shade on the south side means I’ve now decided to buy a couple of single zone Liebherr, probably holding around 180 bottles each.

I plan to store just Bordeaux shaped bottles in one and burgundy shaped bottles in the other.

several questions

1. I know these are not designed to be used below 10C but there is no space in the house for them so they will go in the garage. II plan to run them in the warmer months and just turn them off in the winter. Will this create any problems?

2. Are the supplied shelves strong enough to hold the full capacity or should I buy extra and double shelf them?

3. any other issues I should be aware of?

thanks in advance.
 
I am using Liebherr wine fridges.

1. No idea on that.

2. The supplied shelves are definitely strong enough.

3. It’s highly unlikely you can put 180 bottles in a fridge with 180 bottles capacity, more like 120 bottles to 150 bottles.
 
Any reason you have plumped for Liebherr Kevin?
I have a small Rangemaster 42 bottle fridge in the garage and am in a similar position to you in that I am looking at buying another, larger, fridge.
Although my Rangemaster heats as well as cools, I only switch it on in the hotter months (above the usual 12 degrees temp I try to keep), it hasn't impacted it yet so I plan to do this with the new fridge.

I like to have the bottles nicely laid out in slide out racks so was thinking of getting the Costco 181 bottle fridge or look for a second hand eurocave with the 14 or so slide out shelves.

I've seen old Liebherrs and Eurocaves with very few shelves so I guess people can stuff in boxes or just stack up the wine, I don't know which option would be the most annoying so will be following this thread with interest.
 
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Hi Kevin,

(1) I ran two Liebherrs in my attached garage for a decade with no issues. In the London burbs and rarely hard frosts here but well below 10° for chunks of the winter.

(2) Shelves good

(3) Agree with Chiu!

Generally have found Burgundy and Rhone bottle don't stack that well. Bear in mind that in summer you Liebherr's will be warming up the other wines stacked next to them in the garage!

Neil
 
kevin heatherington said:
I’ve managed to avoid storing wine in a wine fridge until now using the non-integral garage instead which has a pitched roof and remains below outside temperature in the heat of summer (I turn on a small greenhouse heater inside on the very coldest days of winter where the forecast is for below -4). I’ve done this for 15 years without any problems.

However, a combination of too many piles of boxes making it difficult to access the wine and that our neighbours have cut down a large sycamore that provided shade on the south side means I’ve now decided to buy a couple of single zone Liebherr, probably holding around 180 bottles each.

I plan to store just Bordeaux shaped bottles in one and burgundy shaped bottles in the other.

several questions

1. I know these are not designed to be used below 10C but there is no space in the house for them so they will go in the garage. II plan to run them in the warmer months and just turn them off in the winter. Will this create any problems?

2. Are the supplied shelves strong enough to hold the full capacity or should I buy extra and double shelf them?

3. any other issues I should be aware of?

thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
I've run a Liebherr, Miele and Eurocave in the garage for years with no issues. I usually turn the Liebherr off when it gets very cold. So far so good. Shelves on the Liebherr seem a little bendy when over-loaded!
 
Bordeaux bottles are easy to stack up to say 4 or 5 levels whereas Burgundy are not. They always seem to rock about a bit and it can be difficult getting that special bottle out without the whole stack coming too. I'd give some thought to buying some extra shelves for the Burgundy fridge so that you don't have to stack them so high. Obviously this will reduce the number of bottles you'll get in your fridge and from what I recall the extra shelves are fairly expensive.

I'd also give some thought to an indexing system so that you know where each special bottle is. My experience is that the bottle I want always seems to be at the bottom of the stack and I have to remove loads of bottles to get at it. A spreadsheet, labels or something similar could really help.
 
I would say get one with a winter system on it (note that most don’t like it past 32C in summer but mine was fine)
the Climadiff range may get you a larger capacity with winter system for a lot less, unless you have found second hand ones.
If your spending the cash it’s always worth going a little bigger than you think you need :)

I bought the PCLP205 for under £1100 which holds 205 bottles. I should have got bigger :)
 
Mike Humphreys said:
I would say get one with a winter system on it (note that most don’t like it past 32C in summer but mine was fine)
the Climadiff range may get you a larger capacity with winter system for a lot less, unless you have found second hand ones.
If your spending the cash it’s always worth going a little bigger than you think you need :)

I bought the PCLP205 for under £1100 which holds 205 bottles. I should have got bigger :)
Click to expand...
I don’t know about climadiff. Prices seem pretty reasonable. How do they compare to liebherr or other makes?
 
kevin heatherington said:
I know these are not designed to be used below 10C but there is no space in the house for them so they will go in the garage. II plan to run them in the warmer months and just turn them off in the winter. Will this create any problems?
Click to expand...
Do check when you buy, but I was told my Liebherr would warm the wine when ambient temperatures drop below the set temperature. Below a certain temperature (5C I think) the "fridge" would fail to hold the set temperature, but would still function. That certain temperature was quoted as the min operating temperature. Only below zero would there be problems, as the water outlet would freeze.

Consequently, when it was in an outhouse I left it switch on all the time, and had a cheap space heater on a very low setting to prevent freezing.
 
kevin heatherington said:
I don’t know about climadiff. Prices seem pretty reasonable. How do they compare to liebherr or other makes?
Click to expand...
Well they certainly do the job as a ageing cabinet and have decent shelf options. If in a garage / outbuilding you want a solid door as well, not glass so I think they fit the bill perfectly. I have one indoors and one in a outbuilding. They are all simple devices really. I use as a single temp unit.
 
John Devlin said:
I also have a Climadiff and have been very pleased with it so far. Certainly get a bit more for your money that with Liebherr and Eurocave.
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Me too..I've had the 300 bottle version Climadiff for 18 months which is full right now with 227 bottles - I could probably stretch it to 230 - 235 playing Tetris but the Rhone/burg/Loire shapes take up a lot more space than bordeaux-style bottles. It has 6 shelving "bins" which I show as separate locations on Cellartracker so I never have to sift through more than 35 bottles to find what I want. About as nerdy as I'd ever want to get but you'd soon forget where everything is otherwise as you can't see the labels..

It's rated to 0 degrees min. temp. but my garage never gets that low, it heats up in the winter now and again during a cold spell. I leave it on year-round, I've no idea why you'd want to switch it off, as it only needs to chill down to 12-13 degrees it uses far less electricity than a fridge (rated A+)...in any case there's nowhere else in my garage I could store the contents were I to switch it off..

I wouldn't attempt to store wines in their owcs and prefer to leave these off-site..
 
Quick Question:

I was about to buy a Wine fridge with lots of shelving for the convenience of access (see below left).
However, I now understand that the accepted wisdom may be that storage capacity/density becomes the most important factor so fewer shelves, less convenient access but higher density is what people that have owned larger wine fridges before value (below right).
Is this a good assumption?


1620147500271.png1620147525205.png
 
Neil Holland said:
Hi Kevin,

(1) I ran two Liebherrs in my attached garage for a decade with no issues. In the London burbs and rarely hard frosts here but well below 10° for chunks of the winter.

(2) Shelves good

(3) Agree with Chiu!

Generally have found Burgundy and Rhone bottle don't stack that well. Bear in mind that in summer you Liebherr's will be warming up the other wines stacked next to them in the garage!

Neil
Click to expand...
I'm just wondering to what extent a Liebherr will warm up the rest of the cellar/garage/room? My Liebherr is in my spare room, along with a lot of other bottles. I've stored wine in my spare room for many years. I keep the temperature down by keeping the curtains drawn and the radiator drawn. This has usually worked well but in recent years I have noticed that some wines have not lasted as well as one might expect. A couple of 1er crus Burgs from 1996 were out of condition earlier this year, to give one example. I had put this down to global warming but I wonder if the heat pumped out by the Liebherr is also a factor.
 
John Devlin said:
I'd also give some thought to an indexing system so that you know where each special bottle is. My experience is that the bottle I want always seems to be at the bottom of the stack and I have to remove loads of bottles to get at it. A spreadsheet, labels or something similar could really help.
Click to expand...
We have no wine fridges, but this labeling regime has been a game changer. Only downside is I’ve been drinking stuff I’d forgotten I had at a shocking rate.

E4230A9E-D9F4-494F-90D7-EB86D1E9D701.jpeg
 
Alistair Lime said:
Quick Question:

I was about to buy a Wine fridge with lots of shelving for the convenience of access (see below left).
However, I now understand that the accepted wisdom may be that storage capacity/density becomes the most important factor so fewer shelves, less convenient access but higher density is what people that have owned larger wine fridges before value (below right).
Is this a good assumption?
Click to expand...
Yes I think that sums it up well. Also less shelves, solid doors are often cheaper than the more shelves and/or glass door models which is probably a factor for some buyers.

As has been mentioned before stacking Burgundy/Rhone bottles en masse is a challenge. I'd guess that the model on the right with 5 levels of bottles is stacked with Bordeaux. What are you intending to stack? If Bordeaux the model on the right would do fine but it just won't work well for Burgundy/Rhone when the model on the left might be the safer option.
 
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John Devlin said:
Yes I think that sums it up well. Also less shelves, solid doors are often cheaper than the fewer shelves and/or glass door models which is probably a factor for some buyers.

As has been mentioned before stacking Burgundy/Rhone bottles en masse is a challenge. I'd guess that the model on the right with 5 levels of bottles is stacked with Bordeaux. What are you intending to stack? If Bordeaux the model on the right would do fine but it just won't work well for Burgundy/Rhone when the model on the left might be the safer option.
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I don't have too many bordeaux , more rhone, burg and champs. Maybe I need to think about the one on the left which is 188btles and 1149£ vs the Climadiff 264 which is 264 btles and 1399£.
I feel the multi shelf models are more likely to deliver the stated capacity albeit lower.
188 is only 39 less that Johnny is getting in the 300 climadiff model and it is a useful bit cheaper.
Hmmmm, will look at ebay too.
 
Alistair Lime said:
I don't have too many bordeaux , more rhone, burg and champs. Maybe I need to think about the one on the left which is 188btles and 1149£ vs the Climadiff 264 which is 264 btles and 1399£.
I feel the multi shelf models are more likely to deliver the stated capacity albeit lower.
188 is only 39 less that Johnny is getting in the 300 climadiff model and it is a useful bit cheaper.
Hmmmm, will look at ebay too.
Click to expand...
The other element to this is that you can add or adjust the shelves. My first climadiff I have two sliding / presentation shelves then other spaces for stacking up to 3 or 4 bottles high.
my second climadiff has no sliding shelves but has a couple of half shelves at the top allowing to also stand up a few bottles .

Solid door keeps it dark inside so with the humidity of the climadiff (and other brands) is great as an ageing cabinet.
Mine both have the winter warming element so can use in outbuildings or indoors.

What’s the one on the left as looks quite good value with so many shelves.
 
It’s the costco one ‘Montpellier’

Costco

www.costco.co.uk www.costco.co.uk

Looking again it is 181 theoretical rather than 188 and it does seem a bit of a stretch given some similar sized units max out at 120 bottles. A review elsewhere has 154 full and 26 halves so i wonder if half bottles are counted in the max capacity!

With the fewer shelves of the climadiff or liebherr i see you do have way more flexibility and can stand up wine etc
 
David Pope said:
I'm just wondering to what extent a Liebherr will warm up the rest of the cellar/garage/room? My Liebherr is in my spare room, along with a lot of other bottles. I've stored wine in my spare room for many years. I keep the temperature down by keeping the curtains drawn and the radiator drawn. This has usually worked well but in recent years I have noticed that some wines have not lasted as well as one might expect. A couple of 1er crus Burgs from 1996 were out of condition earlier this year, to give one example. I had put this down to global warming but I wonder if the heat pumped out by the Liebherr is also a factor.
Click to expand...

The trouble is that it's just as likely that you'd find out of condition/too old wines from perfect storage. It's incredibly hard to prove these things either way, assuming the wine isn't actually getting very warm.
 
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