Burgundy 2023

J

John Devlin

Location
Salisbury, Wiltshire
I thought I'd start a thread on this topic as no doubt there will be plenty to discuss on the matter over the next few months.

Some prices are starting to appear for 2023s so I decided to do a spot of price comparing this afternoon. I compared five Jadot wines and two Billaud Chablis with the prices that TWS asked last year for the 2022s. The 2023s were cheaper by, on average, 5%. For Billaud I was also able to compare four of his wines 2023 v 2022 between two well known merchants and here the savings were much more-15% in favour of 2023.

So initially it looks promising price wise but will it be enough for you to get your cheque books out? Remember them?
 
From the blurbs it seems like a decent vintage (who knows..) that is also plentiful. There are loads of various excellent older wines out there for same or less. For a drinker, I see no upside (apart from some limited bottles) to the EP wines. And for any investors you'd have to be quite brave wouldn't you?

I always check past vintage prices before jumping in to the EPs these days.
 
Recent offers on VinXchange and L&W for P Bouley Volnay Pluchots were considerably lower than the £48 I.b. recently asked for by a merchant, and the Rion wines on L&W currently being offered seem higher.
 
I went long on 2022 because it felt like (to me) a Jono vintage in terms of style so whether I drink them young or older I know I’ll enjoy them. But I’ve had so much joy backfilling… it is outside of EP definitely a buyers market and there’s plenty of wine. What I would say is that I do still dabble on Burg and Piemonte EP because some of my favourite wines are in such tiny quantities that I want to make sure I get them secured and I’ll happily eat the storage costs.

However for 2023 I will taste before I purchase and interestingly my usual go to merchants haven’t sent any offers out yet even though they normally do December offers ahead of the main campaign where they have a good link to those producers. I’m sure they are just around the corner though.
 
Thom Blach said:
I'd be really interested to know whether anyone at all is buying from the many offers of 2023 Jadot sent out recently. I'm sure the wines are good but I don't see why anyone would unless it's about keeping positions with wines from more fiercely allocated producers.
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I am sure some people will be Tom, but I can't for the life of me understand why they would. Jadot have increased their prices as aggressively as anyone to the point where they are unattractive to those who have been buyers over the longer term. However, there are are always new people coming into the market, especially in Asia, where what went before is irrelevant.
 
Thom Blach said:
I'd be really interested to know whether anyone at all is buying from the many offers of 2023 Jadot sent out recently. I'm sure the wines are good but I don't see why anyone would unless it's about keeping positions with wines from more fiercely allocated producers.
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I feel the same as Richard. The nearest I can come to a positive is the relative value of say Beaune Cras but it's not attractive enough. I didn't even bother to open the email/rest of the offer if was the same BI one.
 
Bumped into our neighbour this morning who works for an historic maison/negociant.
Almost inevitably we discussed recent vintages, prospective release prices vs those available for back vintages. It seems producers are aware but whether they choose to take appropriate action…..
 
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Just been offered the lower level Domaine de Bellene wines at slightly lower prices than 2022… I think that there will be more wine available and more variable than 2022 based on reports. Even been told that I’ll be seeing a Leflaive allocation sooner rather than later… I can imagine that unless there are specific allocations people want to maintain, there will be some options available to backfill with…
 
David Mansfield said:
Leflaive emails came out yesterday
£1000 6 Meursault is now a pass.
£450 6 BB is also easy choice
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Was offered an allocation today of 6x Pucelles and 6xBB. The prices are suitably eye-watering but I think they are what they are. Last year I was only offered the BB and Meursault I think and I passed… last year BB offer was £495 IB this year the BB I’ve been offered is £415 IB. These are lower than the amounts for back vintages currently.
 
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One of the large London merchants have released a few of the 23s as a taster for the full range (full range goes live on 9/1).
I was momentarily interested by the Pierre Vincent Aligoté - his first vintage. Then I saw the price, an eyewatering £300/6.
Sure, he has built a reputation at other domaines but that seems more than a little punchy for a first year on his own.
 
A flick through the Flint offer made me think that prices have in fact gone up again, but comparing to last year's prices reveals that actually most have decreased by 3-5%, with only a few going up.

A spot check on wine-searcher shows that a lot of 2022s are still available at release prices (not necessarily from Flint/Stannary themselves), which presumably explains the reduction...
 
New Burgundian producers entering the market charging punchy prices almost seems pretty normal now. That said its an even bolder move in 2025 than it might have been say 3 years ago.

I do find it hard to fathom just how many will blow sizeable cash on cases of wine from producers whose wines they have never drunk previously.
 
Bordeaux started it: aiming to match prices of 'neighbours/rivals.
Very occasionally, I will buy the wines of a newby based on recommendation of a couple of trusted merchants or where I have tasted the wine.
Alternatively, there are enough producers who have not jumped on the bandwagon.
 
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