TN The type of Red Burg I dream about...

Discussion in 'UK Wine Forum' started by Richard Ward, Jul 13, 2018.

  1. Domaine Ponsot Chambolle Musigny 1er Cru Les Charmes 2004

    The nose. It's all about the nose. Earth, manure, really old leather, bark yet also the absolute freshest of fresh and pure dark berry fruits. Good acidity but seamless and beautifully textured. This wine is almost obsequious in how it flits between incredible purity of fruit and all those glorious secondary notes, seemingly at will.

    I seem to drink a bottle of Burgundy like this about every 2 years and it's sufficient to keep me persevering through all the duds, the what ifs and the nearlies.

    Life is good.
     
  2. Was that with donner meat on naan? The perfect foil I find!:)
     
  3. It’s a lovely, isn’t it. My three bottles were splendid.
     
    Richard Ward likes this.
  4. Ponsot seemed to fare well in 2004
     
  5. So how to increase the hit rate? I don't think one can ever be close to any certainty because the real magic of burgundy is the way that a bottle that one expects to be quite nice can astonish by being utterly magical when one isn't specially looking for it, but grower and age is key rather than cru, vintage and indeed price, I'd say, and reviews of individual bottles by even the most eminent commentators when the wines were new do not give much of a guide to magic. 04 is a not particularly highly regarded vintage but at age 14 it has some very definite evolution and resolution to it, a much better bet than 05 and while 06 is terrific it won't have that nose yet. For me modest vintages at reasonable prices from good producers are absolutely the way to go, and having lived quite intensely through vintages from say 1985 to 2008 the idea that weaker vintages need drinking in the near term is the way to deprive ourselves of some of the greatest of all vinous pleasures. The grand vintages are simple, you just keep them as if they were bordeaux and eventually a great time will be had by all, but I think they hardly ever offer magic at 14 years old even if they might when they are 3.
     
  6. How about a relatively modest wine from a very good, if not absolutely top, producer, in a great vintage? Last night we drank Denis Bachelet’s village Gevrey-Chambertin 1999, which was excellent. It had a ravishing, mature nose, while the palate was very well developed but with just a lingering touch of primary fruit. Lovely stuff.
     
  7. Fabulous wine, Colin, though an attempt to repurchase may prompt a reconsideration of its modesty! I would say Bachelet was an absolutely top producer, and this wine has always drunk beautifully.
     
  8. Ans no hint of ladybird either, Richard!

    Sounds delish.
     
  9. More and more I'm becoming convinced there is very little wrong with 2004s. I've had quite a few, and still own quite a few including various GC. Whatever it was is definitely dissipating with age.

    I know there are others who disagree, but all I can say is you are quite welcome to sell any unwanted wines to me!
     
  10. It's a vintage which has more than its fair share of dizzyingly beautiful if quite unconventional bottles but the bad ones can be shocking. I've not come across one for over two years now though and there is no doubt that some terrible offenders have sorted themselves out, which if I understand the science correctly( which is extremely unlikely) means that they can't have been pyrazines in the first place.
    It can be hard to know what's going to happen when one opens a bottle of Ponsot, particularly before full maturity, but they can be of the most heartbreaking beauty.
     
  11. Whilst not disagreeing with Tom, I think there is another strategy to pursue in parallel. In an outstanding vintage, buy modest wines from good growers, and 1er Crus from minor or neglected villages, or even from the Hautes Cotes, if you trust your merchant(s) to find the best producers.

    We are currently working our happy way through several cases of 2005s of this type, Santenay VV (Marc Colin), two premiers crus St Aubins (Henri Prudhon), and Gevrey VV (Geantet-Pansiot). They are all delicious. You can still buy cases of at least some of these wines from the 2009 and 2015 vintages for less than £17 a bottle.
     
  12. While that's a good strategy if one wants to drink delicious wines I'm not sure it works if one is looking for the magic that I think Richard is describing, Mark, though that must always be mostly about serendipity.
     
  13. Point taken, Tom. But some bottles of the Santenay, and of the G-P Gevrey "En Champs" (rather than the simple VV) actually have delivered that special magic, modest though they are.
     
  14. Has anyone tasted Geantet's 04s?
     
  15. Where about Mark?
     
  16. Incidentally I think the days are gone when much village Gevrey justifies the adjective modest. Mostly not only with regard to price but with regard to quality to give credit to the producers.
     
    Ben Coffman likes this.

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